This is an update on an earlier blog about mh17 while bellingcat and kiev withheld the names of the so called witnesses in an attempt to hide incriminating videos {further down the page} and photos but thanks to max van der werff we can reveal the witnesses are ukraine army and so-called buk vapor trail is blatant lies some of the key players are linked to pravy sektor and known maidan snipers were in the area
While the bellingcat report is quite detailed in focusing on only the alleged russian supplied buk and only one aspect of it based on a badly photo-shopped buk in donetsk. However he completely dismisses as "russian propaganda" if you point out that the ukraine army owns buk 312 and that ukraine had su25 in the area.
He also failed to state that there was a massive battle between rebel fighters and the kiev government just south of torez and snizhne and just 30kms north of the mh17 crash site. Another key failure of his report is that he relied on social media reports from twitter and facebook of {now known} ukrainian soldiers and pro kiev bloggers and also the SBU. And simply scoffed at any information given to him by anyone who was at odds with his narrative.And never once visited ukraine to see for himself these points of interest or spoke to any people surrounding the events.
All the while dismissing as idiotic or russian propagandists -forensic scientists, -UN weapon specialists, -eye witnesses on the day, -osce members, -su25 pilots, -missile specialists, -a former crew member on buk312, -and former pilots from europe according to bellingcat {eliot higgins} all the above people are morons who don't know what they are taking about. Quite an assertion from somebody who has never been involved in any specialist forensic or military field attributed to the above people. he also makes no mention of the ukrainian army transport plane shot down east of snizhne in his bellingcat report. and pro kiev twitter pages were commenting on it i doubt that he knew nothing about it
i have little doubt that eliot came across the information i will post so surrounding the events around the cock and bull rebels had the buk story fed to him by kiev ,,SBU and the support network of these volunteer battalion even with this story i find it puzzling that he came to the conclusion that rebels shot down mh17 after finding this information using "open sources" suncalc and google images one tweet led to the next and on too the "sources" who posted videos etc etc . No doubt that i will be accused as a russian propagandist but i will be using the pro ukrainian tweets-blogs-video postings-message board posts and their own "evidence" to prove they are bullshitting on level that exceeds that of walter mitty. Bellingcat working on the information that was supplied to him by the SBU and those who have a vested interest in hiding the facts is a willing conduit for the blatant falsehoods put out by kiev.
And while using suncalc he knows full well that the snizhne buk is unrelated to the buk photographed in donetsk and he withheld the names of the so called witness not to protect their safety but because he is ukraine army and for reasons know only to himself completely ignored these critical facts. that there was two planes shot down on the 17th and videos a photos were collected together and presented as one event. The bellingcat report has also collected both and posted as one event i don't think this was a deliberate attempt to deceive but if he spent less time attempting to put a russian buk into the hands of the rebels via a badly photo-shopped buk he may have pick up on this.
Bellingcat who receives payments from the george soros funded atlantic council and anti russian "think tank" cites wikipedia sources to back up his "rebel buk theory" Wikipedia entries that he himself edits and publishes and to ensure these wikipedia entries dont get rejected by admins he cites BELLINGCAT as his source for wikipedia entries. He also cites the ukrainian intelligence agency the SBU as his sources so how can his investigation be given any credibility
1 Although i don't believe bellingcat looked into what activities those linked to the coup government were doing at the time of the mh17 instead became fixated on putting the 'smoking gun " in rebel hands their movements and the blatant lies they have finally been caught out on the pre-planned murder of 298 innocent people the evidence provided is a badly photo-shopped buk in donesk claimed to be "anonymous" by bellingcat even though he is named in the parismatch story which wasn't taken by parismatch in was given to alfred de by members of the SBU who told him they were "russians". And a contrail photo claimed to be "anonymous" by bellingcat we now know to have been taken by a ukraine army photographer part of a recon unit named as pavel aleynikov and not one single person living in area reported seeing it. and in the crash videos no vapor trail is seen of the buk allegedly fired at mh17. kiev said they had no buk deployed which is false as we will see down the page. T he source of the smoke plume used to prove a buk launch is in fact smoke from artillery strikes around saur mogila
kiev put forward photos claiming to be the rebel owned buk which is later outed as kiev owned. The ukrainian army had 27 out of their 60 buk systems deployed throughout donetsk and luhansk . The day before {16th july} mh17 was shot down and the ukrainian army even had a promotional video on their official army website {now removed}. The ukrainian army had military personnel located in strategic locations to act as "witnesses" and fake photos posted to the web under fake identities Knowing this and no actual proof rebels had access to a buk unit i cannot understand why kiev is not the primary suspect and is quite surprising western media still think rebels did it
2 many eyewitnesses say that seen the crash stated they heard a number of explosions in the sky and some seen a military plane leaving the area kiev claimed they had no military planes flying up to and on they day of mh17 which is blatant lies as rebels shot down a number of planes and a ukrainian military operator says 3 planes were active at the time and one of this planes returned without their air2air missiles bellingcat attempts to discredit this information with quite frankly outrageous claims such as su25 cant fire their missiles at high altitude or i will fall out of the sky and the witnesses were directed by russian FSB to say those things which is impossible as the very first people to speak to witnesses was western press who later tried to erase their own footage
3some of the so called evidence was uploaded to the internet the day prior which is dubious as it was uploaded by members of the ukrainian army ..even at the alleged rebels firing location not one ukrainian soldiers that were engaged in combat against the rebels ever reported seeing a buk launch ..all the witnesses who saw what happened the --osce members who gave an opinion that plane appeared to have bullet holes ---russian airforce releasing data--- missile operators giving movements of ukr buk system-- actual un approved weapons experts who according to eliot higgins all liars who dont know what they are talking about ...instead eliot relies on wikipedia--pro kiev supporters--the SBU-- his own sofa expertise on what happened ...eliot knows all they information i will be posting so he is making a mockery of mh17 victims by covering for the ukrainian army by peddling their cock and bull story which itself doesn't add up these key facts were ignored by bellingcat and western press
Mh17 was directed to fly over the area which is over 200km outside of their normal flight route
A member of ukrainian army ground crew states he heard 2 ukr pilots discussing shooting down "the wrong plane"
ukraine army caught blatantly lying about their own buk deployments
A badly photo-shopped "rebel buk" photo
A buk contrail photo provided by and only witnessed by pavel aleynikov in which Dr. Neal Krawetz states is a heavily doctored image
Vladimir karas {kyiv-2} posted mh17 "evidence" to the internet 2hours before the crash
A witness who saw the actual attack on mh17 while others seen fighter planes leaving the scene of the attack
The service height of the su25 was edited on wikipedia to 7000 meters in an attempt rule out su25 as a suspect as mh17 was flying just above 10000 meters the service height listed on wikipedia from 2005 is 10000 meters
i challenge anybody to prove or show that i have posted any falsehoods and screaming "you're a kremlin troll liar" is not proof. eliot higgins is making a mockery of these victims by putting himself forward as an expert witness when he has zero expertise in any of the forensic skills needed to examine crash data. And he has never once visited the crash site all the while peddling as fact a clearly pre made easily debunked story put out by kiev and it is completely baffling that western media and eliot higgins completely ignores eyewitnesses who saw exactly what happened and actual experts are sidelined because they don't tow the official line instead relying on the cock and bull story fed to them by kiev
He also failed to state that there was a massive battle between rebel fighters and the kiev government just south of torez and snizhne and just 30kms north of the mh17 crash site. Another key failure of his report is that he relied on social media reports from twitter and facebook of {now known} ukrainian soldiers and pro kiev bloggers and also the SBU. And simply scoffed at any information given to him by anyone who was at odds with his narrative.And never once visited ukraine to see for himself these points of interest or spoke to any people surrounding the events.
All the while dismissing as idiotic or russian propagandists -forensic scientists, -UN weapon specialists, -eye witnesses on the day, -osce members, -su25 pilots, -missile specialists, -a former crew member on buk312, -and former pilots from europe according to bellingcat {eliot higgins} all the above people are morons who don't know what they are taking about. Quite an assertion from somebody who has never been involved in any specialist forensic or military field attributed to the above people. he also makes no mention of the ukrainian army transport plane shot down east of snizhne in his bellingcat report. and pro kiev twitter pages were commenting on it i doubt that he knew nothing about it
i have little doubt that eliot came across the information i will post so surrounding the events around the cock and bull rebels had the buk story fed to him by kiev ,,SBU and the support network of these volunteer battalion even with this story i find it puzzling that he came to the conclusion that rebels shot down mh17 after finding this information using "open sources" suncalc and google images one tweet led to the next and on too the "sources" who posted videos etc etc . No doubt that i will be accused as a russian propagandist but i will be using the pro ukrainian tweets-blogs-video postings-message board posts and their own "evidence" to prove they are bullshitting on level that exceeds that of walter mitty. Bellingcat working on the information that was supplied to him by the SBU and those who have a vested interest in hiding the facts is a willing conduit for the blatant falsehoods put out by kiev.
And while using suncalc he knows full well that the snizhne buk is unrelated to the buk photographed in donetsk and he withheld the names of the so called witness not to protect their safety but because he is ukraine army and for reasons know only to himself completely ignored these critical facts. that there was two planes shot down on the 17th and videos a photos were collected together and presented as one event. The bellingcat report has also collected both and posted as one event i don't think this was a deliberate attempt to deceive but if he spent less time attempting to put a russian buk into the hands of the rebels via a badly photo-shopped buk he may have pick up on this.
Bellingcat who receives payments from the george soros funded atlantic council and anti russian "think tank" cites wikipedia sources to back up his "rebel buk theory" Wikipedia entries that he himself edits and publishes and to ensure these wikipedia entries dont get rejected by admins he cites BELLINGCAT as his source for wikipedia entries. He also cites the ukrainian intelligence agency the SBU as his sources so how can his investigation be given any credibility
1 Although i don't believe bellingcat looked into what activities those linked to the coup government were doing at the time of the mh17 instead became fixated on putting the 'smoking gun " in rebel hands their movements and the blatant lies they have finally been caught out on the pre-planned murder of 298 innocent people the evidence provided is a badly photo-shopped buk in donesk claimed to be "anonymous" by bellingcat even though he is named in the parismatch story which wasn't taken by parismatch in was given to alfred de by members of the SBU who told him they were "russians". And a contrail photo claimed to be "anonymous" by bellingcat we now know to have been taken by a ukraine army photographer part of a recon unit named as pavel aleynikov and not one single person living in area reported seeing it. and in the crash videos no vapor trail is seen of the buk allegedly fired at mh17. kiev said they had no buk deployed which is false as we will see down the page. T he source of the smoke plume used to prove a buk launch is in fact smoke from artillery strikes around saur mogila
kiev put forward photos claiming to be the rebel owned buk which is later outed as kiev owned. The ukrainian army had 27 out of their 60 buk systems deployed throughout donetsk and luhansk . The day before {16th july} mh17 was shot down and the ukrainian army even had a promotional video on their official army website {now removed}. The ukrainian army had military personnel located in strategic locations to act as "witnesses" and fake photos posted to the web under fake identities Knowing this and no actual proof rebels had access to a buk unit i cannot understand why kiev is not the primary suspect and is quite surprising western media still think rebels did it
2 many eyewitnesses say that seen the crash stated they heard a number of explosions in the sky and some seen a military plane leaving the area kiev claimed they had no military planes flying up to and on they day of mh17 which is blatant lies as rebels shot down a number of planes and a ukrainian military operator says 3 planes were active at the time and one of this planes returned without their air2air missiles bellingcat attempts to discredit this information with quite frankly outrageous claims such as su25 cant fire their missiles at high altitude or i will fall out of the sky and the witnesses were directed by russian FSB to say those things which is impossible as the very first people to speak to witnesses was western press who later tried to erase their own footage
3some of the so called evidence was uploaded to the internet the day prior which is dubious as it was uploaded by members of the ukrainian army ..even at the alleged rebels firing location not one ukrainian soldiers that were engaged in combat against the rebels ever reported seeing a buk launch ..all the witnesses who saw what happened the --osce members who gave an opinion that plane appeared to have bullet holes ---russian airforce releasing data--- missile operators giving movements of ukr buk system-- actual un approved weapons experts who according to eliot higgins all liars who dont know what they are talking about ...instead eliot relies on wikipedia--pro kiev supporters--the SBU-- his own sofa expertise on what happened ...eliot knows all they information i will be posting so he is making a mockery of mh17 victims by covering for the ukrainian army by peddling their cock and bull story which itself doesn't add up these key facts were ignored by bellingcat and western press
Mh17 was directed to fly over the area which is over 200km outside of their normal flight route
A member of ukrainian army ground crew states he heard 2 ukr pilots discussing shooting down "the wrong plane"
ukraine army caught blatantly lying about their own buk deployments
A badly photo-shopped "rebel buk" photo
A buk contrail photo provided by and only witnessed by pavel aleynikov in which Dr. Neal Krawetz states is a heavily doctored image
Vladimir karas {kyiv-2} posted mh17 "evidence" to the internet 2hours before the crash
A witness who saw the actual attack on mh17 while others seen fighter planes leaving the scene of the attack
The service height of the su25 was edited on wikipedia to 7000 meters in an attempt rule out su25 as a suspect as mh17 was flying just above 10000 meters the service height listed on wikipedia from 2005 is 10000 meters
i challenge anybody to prove or show that i have posted any falsehoods and screaming "you're a kremlin troll liar" is not proof. eliot higgins is making a mockery of these victims by putting himself forward as an expert witness when he has zero expertise in any of the forensic skills needed to examine crash data. And he has never once visited the crash site all the while peddling as fact a clearly pre made easily debunked story put out by kiev and it is completely baffling that western media and eliot higgins completely ignores eyewitnesses who saw exactly what happened and actual experts are sidelined because they don't tow the official line instead relying on the cock and bull story fed to them by kiev
Events leading up to and around the attack on mh17 ...much of the below information only came to light once the name of the "anonymous" buk launch witnesses was known ..the ukraine army tried to bury the names of so called witnesses and their own videos
june9th
On june 9th a so-called independent news outlet euromaidan-pr which is pro kiev government support network based in the united states posted a video to their youtube channel see the posted video here in which semen semenchenko {masked} a senior figure in donbass battalion giving an interview purported to be 6th where he is discussing being sent into the "ATO" in east ukraine.
june 18th
In mid june 2014 rebel fighters in east ukraine began commenting on the fact the ukraine airforce was directing civilian aircraft over the area around snizhne which is well outside the normal flight paths used by civilian aircraft and with donetsk airport west of snizhne closed due to it being under heavy bombardment these civil planes were being used as cover for su25 to conduct bombing raids by flying just below them as cover.
Below is a short video of a rebel fighter elena which was posted to youtube in june 18th in slavyansk in the main square over a month prior to the shoot down of mh17 the originally posted video was reported and removed despite not breaching any youtube tos here is a video showing .the upload date The video could not be made after 5-7th july when kiev forces took control of slavyansk so i have no basis to doubt that it was posted to youtube on the 18th june so it cannot be said that rebels only made it to cover their tracks. Below the photo is the video in slavyansk which pro kiev and anti russian westerners are trying to remove from all social networks but you can see it below the photos.
you can download slavyansk video here
29th june
july 5th
kiev forces take the city of slavyansk
kiev army had buk deployed including 321 which was was posted to an apparently pro rebel page on the 29th june and as rebels never captured any ukrainian army buk and SBU states in their cock and bull story russia didn't supply a buk until 17th july which clearly proves this page was created to sow misinformation and shows that the attack on mh 17 was planned 3 weeks before watch ukrainian army deployment video here posted to this youtube account in case of deletion my upload here
july 7th
kiev retakes artemivsk and druzhkivka
july 11th
Just prior to the crash poroshenko announced on 11th of july that the rebels were in for a nasty surprise in donesk ?? what is this nasty surprise ..chemical weapons??overwhelming force??nato boots on the ground??..This statement came right after kiev forces took the village of siversk 100km northeast of donetsk and just east of slavyansk
july 15th
kiev takes chrinkino east of debaltsevo
july 16th {two videos kiev army has tried to erase}
Ukraine su 25 shot down video here
second su 25 shot down in snizhne as this pro kiev tweeter has shared however the video channel that shared it has been terminated
JULY 17TH despite their claims their own vids shows su25 active late evening july17th the people in the video state that 2 su25 were engaged in the attack and appear to have come from the settlement of severnyy donetsk they also say militia {DNR} fired a missile at one of these planes. area under attack is near to were mh17 was brought down see vid here
Even though i doubt that any buk was fired i will include the ukr army own video showing they are lying. In the aftermath of mh17 the kiev army claim that they had no buk units deployed and if any buk were seen they must be rebel owned. Even this story is at odds with later SBU statements saying rebels only took delivery of a buk from russia on the morning of the 17th but as will see from their own videos that they tried to delete from the web they are lying. Just north of slavyansk kiev had 2-5 out of the 27 buk units deployed throughout the luhansk and donbass areas which can be seen in their own promo video.
Which is quite odd as rebels have no aircraft. Another oddity is that these buk units are manned by members of donbass battalion a pro kiev militia formed a few months beforehand from maidan protesters who most certainly have zero knowledge on the operation of a buk m1 anti aircraft missile system. kiev claimed they had no buk deployed so if any were seen they belonged to the rebels which conflicts with the SBU later claims that the rebels only took delivery of a russian supplied buk the morning of the 17th this is blatant lies from kiev as we see from their own videos which they tried to erase from the net
Also deployed to these 2-5 buk stationed north of slavyansk is american mercenaries stan patton {later KIA at donetsk airport} and another man { unknown name} who was on the maidan the day of the sniper attacks {caught with sniper rifles} who work for blackwater/XE services/or whatever they are called now. These americans would know even less than donbass battalion about the buk system so what are they doing at the deployment of the 3-5 buk systems north of slavyansk.
The ukrainian government forces even recorded a promotional video of the buk deployed. This was featured on a ukrainian tv channel and uploaded on 16th july 2014 on the youtube channel of TV MILITARY UKRAINE but in the aftermath of mh17 the ukr army removed it from their military website and youtube video1 i also found another video showing that this detachment was still there up to the 17th {in case of ukr army deletion video1 16th...video2 17th also screenshot ukrainian army claimed they had no buk deployed in the area but as you can see from their own video they are lying
The ukrainian government forces even recorded a promotional video of the buk deployed. This was featured on a ukrainian tv channel and uploaded on 16th july 2014 on the youtube channel of TV MILITARY UKRAINE but in the aftermath of mh17 the ukr army removed it from their military website and youtube video1 i also found another video showing that this detachment was still there up to the 17th {in case of ukr army deletion video1 16th...video2 17th also screenshot ukrainian army claimed they had no buk deployed in the area but as you can see from their own video they are lying
from 5th july the buk that
was supposed to be in rebel hands from june
located just north of slavyansk i am posting some screenshots of the most likely location of the ukrainian army buk deployment video from the 1st= 16th july 2014 based on some of the road markings angle of the road layout and tree lines. the video screen shot is from ukraine army video as they had just taken control of the area and were still setting up their base of operations. The satellite photo screenshot which shows heavy marking in the field after the fact ..i strongly suspect this is the site shown in the video based on the information on ukr army mounting an offensive on slavyansk prior to the 5th july on the treeline {although some trees appear to be missing in the satellite snapshot than shown in the video}
Below is a screenshot showing the crash site at grabovo circled red and the areas known to contain the ukrainian army and donbass battalion based on press releases of active battles between donbass-batt/ukraine army and NAF and as you can see in the blue route line the are clearly the buk units we now know they have in the area are well within range of hitting mh17 {although i still doubt a buk was fired at all as not one single witness apart from pavel aleynikov {ukraine army recon unit} reported seeing a buk vapor trail. yellow x is the village of churnokhyne///chernuhinskoho
july 17th
The crash of mh17 and the rebel buk story that doesn't add up
On the day of the mh17 crash it was 200/250 kilometers further east than the usual flight route and according to reports from the dutch safety board mh 17 communicated with control services at dneppropetrovsk. It then changed direction from their flight route turning on a more eastern direction to bring it directly over an active combat zone where a number of ukrainian air force su25 planes had been shot down in the days before. John mccain stated on cnn the ukraine army dont have the capability {buk} to shoot high altitude planes which is a blatant falsehood as kiev army has 60 buk units as seen on one of their websites also a link to the photo here and of those 60 units 27 were deployed prior to and on the day of 17th july
kiev sbu security services and unknown foreigners were in the control tower very shortly after of the plane crash..very odd as its a civilian airport and took all flight info data and to date refuse to release it to any investigation team
On the day of the attack a spanish air traffic controller working at kiev airport tracked two military planes following the plane and posted it on his twitter page @spainbuca about 3 hours later {which was deleted however original link leads to a cloned page an image search of this new account leads to a large number of twitter pages with very similar content posted } the original spainbuca last twitter intries were archived by @spainbucaARCH also see the twitter storm his tweets created in this PDFdocument which you can download to see the tweets posted in response to spainbuca
He also gave interview {sorry english speakers its in spanish} . You can see the tweets in photo one ..... photo two of just how far mh17 was from their normal flight route { 200/250km} and in photo two can see black star marking the approx crash site and have to wonder why why was a civilian plane sent into an area where it was know that f/planes were being shot down at a rate of 1 a day
Another oddity is that the first reply to spainbuca tweet was from @Lubalas however the account has no trace on google and now twitter has now no listing for him. spainbuca also implicates minister of the interior and yulia timoshenko with some involvement with the attack see it in a transcript of his tweets
kiev sbu security services and unknown foreigners were in the control tower very shortly after of the plane crash..very odd as its a civilian airport and took all flight info data and to date refuse to release it to any investigation team
On the day of the attack a spanish air traffic controller working at kiev airport tracked two military planes following the plane and posted it on his twitter page @spainbuca about 3 hours later {which was deleted however original link leads to a cloned page an image search of this new account leads to a large number of twitter pages with very similar content posted } the original spainbuca last twitter intries were archived by @spainbucaARCH also see the twitter storm his tweets created in this PDFdocument which you can download to see the tweets posted in response to spainbuca
He also gave interview {sorry english speakers its in spanish} . You can see the tweets in photo one ..... photo two of just how far mh17 was from their normal flight route { 200/250km} and in photo two can see black star marking the approx crash site and have to wonder why why was a civilian plane sent into an area where it was know that f/planes were being shot down at a rate of 1 a day
Another oddity is that the first reply to spainbuca tweet was from @Lubalas however the account has no trace on google and now twitter has now no listing for him. spainbuca also implicates minister of the interior and yulia timoshenko with some involvement with the attack see it in a transcript of his tweets
A LOOK AT THE NORTHERN VIDEO AND LOCATION
for ease i will be referring to the mykaelvisk eyewitness video as the northern video i will post some photos from one the videos of the mh17 crash that is from a location i believe is the yard the video was shot for a number of reasons such as the approx distance from the crash the size of the yard treeline and mounds of debris which appears to align with approx route of mh17. the site is just outside to the northeast of the village of mykhaelivka north of shakhtarsk and as i know bellingcat often uses geolocation to support his theories i doubt that he missed this as it shows the direction of where the rebel buk would have been fired from
photo1
is the overview of the area in the first video i will post and show the line of sight from the work yard {yellow star} to crash site {orange circle} the location is just outside the village of mykailivka north of shakhtarsk which i will be calling the northern eyewitness video at the bottom of the photos
photo2
a closer look of the yard and the crash site which appears to line up with the mounds of debris and treeline to the left side of the cameraman facing toward the crash site
photo 3
i have rotated the image of the yard to show direction of the crash which appears to show that direction of the tire marks towards an entrance as seen from the camera position {yellow star} the rising height of the bushes to the left of the cameraman and the debris in front of him at the blue line
photo4
in this image i have rotated the map image to show the direction the camera is facing and as
The blue line leads to the crash site which you can visit just cop/paste location into your browser 48.138480, 38.638968
The yellow line leads to where the supposed video of the buk in snizhne
And red lines lead to where the buk contrail smoke was apparently taken
The green arrow lines are from the flight path of mh17 so at a guess the point of attack on mh17 would be just in front and above the cameraman and as you can see from the video a telltale contrail that a buk leaves behind cannot been seen from either the yellow line that us officials claims is the launch site or red lines where the so-called contrail is located and near torez .
So you can see why a am suspicious that no buk was fired at all you can watch a buk missile training video here and as the bottom screenshot shows that there was breaks in the clouds so surely a buk contrail would have been visible in the top right of the screen and approx attack point on the plane was above and in front of the cameraman
download your own copy here
The sbu "rebel buk proof video" was uploaded to the net 3 days before the attack
The sbu released an apparent rebel intercepted phonecall onto youtube claiming that russia had smuggled a buk-M1 into ukraine the time and date of this phone call is dated 14-07-2014 the major problems with this SBU intercept is that the area they say the buk was smuggled into ukraine was under the control of the ukrainian army at the time although the livemap may not be 100% accurate ukraine army did control a sizable part of the south east area making it highly unlikely russia {or rebels} would risk transporting through an area where it would be captured or destroyed by the ukraine army
july 18th -the web of lies begins
minister of interior arsen avakov was caught red handed lying through his teeth when he posted a facebook update stating that terrorist buk was recorded at 4.30am in krasnadon as you can see from his post ..surely if it was really a rebel buk as he as the head of ministry of the interior he would be privy to all intelligence gathered by the SBU the actual location of this buk is in government controlled western luhansk as eliot higgins found out by geo-locating it surprisingly he still has this unedited post here {he updated it in his comment feed} and the location of the truck can be seen in the luhansk buk post down the page
On the following day just 12 hours after the attack western media already had the narrative framed that russia and the rebels were guilty of the attack with sensational headlines like "putins missile"and "russian rocket kills 300" well they are partially right as the buk system is made in russia. But it is used by 14 countries including ukraine. And how they knew for sure it was a missile in the first place is beyond me all their "proof" seems to be based on the photo of buk 312 and a later to be outed as fraudulent a supposed intercepted phone call between rebels.
For buk two {3x2}they even released a 13 second video as "proof" recorded by the ukrainian security services SBU possibly just north of donetsk however the ukrainian SBU was less keen on the video of buk one {312} being seen. When i was in discussion with a pro kiev supporter he scoffed that he had video evidence the rebels were caught transporting it back to russia and provided me with a video which i downloaded. An oversight on his part but he never actually seen the video before giving it to me because the video shows that this buk unit actually belongs to the ukrainian army and it was being transported around ukraine in mid march { he deleted his video soon after } >>>>>video<<<<< there was a second better quality video taken on the same night here
And as you can see from the below photos both trucks carrying buks are different truck ONE has a plain white cab and a green trailer without ramps ...and truck TWO which is alleged by kiev as the rebel unit heading back to russia has a blue stripe on the cab and a red trailer so it's obvious kiev are telling a pack of lies
 |
The incriminating tweets
So it appears that the photo touted as proof that this buk was in rebel hands on the morning of 17th at 10.00 is dubious at best and "verified" by paris match calls into question their credibility. And despite not visiting ukraine or seeing the photographer i'm unsure how bellingcat manages to "verify"that the photo was taken on the morning of the 17th. And a deleted video {saved vid here} said to be 11.40 am {kiev time} was posted to youtube showing the alleged buk in zurhes east of donetsk the user goes by the name of Andrei and so posting the buk video appears to be the only activity on this account
However that account does list a pro kiev blogpage where he posts photo "evidence" which will be his undoing further down this blog when i show that the ukraine army owns this buk. Then a number of tweets were posted the first known twitter post i can find of this torez buk was posted by the pro kiev @euromaidan and is at 6.35 {14.35 UTC} here is a link to the tweet
Another "social media user who worked for ihor kolomoiski's privat bank ruslan navadyuk then posted this photo alleged to have been taken at approx 12.30 local time to the vk page of ukrainian miltary portal {UTAG} am {12.41 kiev time} then a video of the alleged buk in snizhne and was stated by bellingcat to be approx1.00- 1.30 However after using the suncalc webpage i found that this is incorrect the video appears to be much earlier at about 10.00 am so the buk in snizhne has no relation to the buk seen in donetsk-makiiva-shastorsk-torez as the photographed buk was making its way east from 9.30-1.00pm .
Exposing the lies peddled by kiev....how can a buk be in 4 locations within 30 minutes at about 10-10.30 am ironically the same time a google earth images and how can members of kyiv-2 post mh17 evidence 2 hour before the crash ????
The times are questionable especially considering the source
NOTE i discussed the suncalc versus the official story attributed to the kiev provided photos with eliott higgins only for him to scoff that "you do realize that 2 hours must be added to suncalc for time difference" well i am man enough to admit that i initially was wrong in stating that suncalc is based on local time it is not it is based on users location which for me is 0-utc {ireland/uk} but eliot higgins is also wrong when he stated local donbass time is +2 utc that added 2 hours applies to kiev only donbass is +3 hour utc so the below suncalc screen grabs are based on 0-utc and i will post local donbass time as " DT>><< "
Even this rebel buk theory but forward doesn't add up because how can the donetsk eastbound buk {09.30/10am utc DT12.00} be driven through snizhne 70km away at the same time {09.30/10am utc}. By all means call me a crank but prove me wrong !!!!! Using the suncalc app can you come up with a better explanation as to how these grainy photos despite being about 50 meters away from the cameraman still show the donetsk-zurhes-snizhne buk all appear to be at 09.30/10 am. Just type in the location and date you wish to view.
I have asked eliot to give me an explanation on this photo-shopped buk on seven occasions however he has yet to give an answer
>>>>>update ..he simply said it's not photo-shopped end of discussion :} <<<<
i suggest you check it out for yourself i will post the suncalc page links to the locations and links to the photos and if you can explain away the fact that it appears to be between 10=10.30 i'm all ears. and copy/paste the locations into your browser
suncalc just type in the date and location and satellite top right of the page
the donetsk buk site 48.004560, 37.872778 and image link
while in a discussion with eliot higgins i brought up the issue that the torez buk photo posted saying that "here is the proof rebels shot down mh17" on holywars it states on google that this thread discussion was started on the 16th july by a user by the name of toterman and is under the politics tag and then the first comments appear on the 18th and this date is when eliot seems to think that this is when the post was made if this is the case then where did his initial post go to as he is not listed on comments and then why would google list this comment as started on 16th 2 hours prior to mh17 shoot down
the header on photo 2 is when it was first posted on the 16th and as donbass time is 11 hours ahead of google head quarters in san francisco i am only stating that for google to have the post listing on the 16th it cannot be posted to the internet any later than 11am UTC on the morning of the 17th 2hours and 20 minutes before mh17 was shot down at 13.20 UTC
and is clearly seen in the google listing this post states MH17 in the post whoever posted this knew something about the mh17 crash 2 hours beforehand which can only mean that this was pre-planned attack on mh17 if "evidence" of the mh17 attack was posted beforehand ......which part of this is confusing to pro kiev supporters .......toterman only lists one forum thread starter
Donetsk buk
even though this is photo-shopped i will still include it to show that kiev are lying and their story simply doesn't add up
The first sighting of the alleged mh 17 and after david clinch contacted parismatch for information about the photo and it was confirmed by them that this donetsk buk photo was "given" to @AdeMontesquiou by an anonymous reporter and was not taken by {alfred de montesquiou } as many pro kiev claim see the parismatch story these anonymous reporters told alfred de montesquiou that they spoke to the truck driver and they had broad russian federation accents .
I have a few issues with this version of events firstly why would alleged russian buk personnel who are supposed to be in the country covertly even stop to speak to local reporters and secondly if they did have time to speak to the driver how come they only managed to get a ridiculously bad drive by photo. and given that we now know what pavel aleynikov was doing in the area its possibly that it was pavel who took the photo of the truck and trailer while it was transporting a damaged apc and the buk was later photo-shopped into the photo which was taken while he was driving past it
The photo of the truck that was making its way to makiiva and as you can see from the photo the shadow cast by the buk the time is approx 10.00 am but no later than 10.30 and as you can see from the panoramic view the shadow is falling towards the opel dealership just across the road from this slipway where the buk was parked approx where the road sweeper is. I encourage anyone to view the street view and use the suncalc and see the buk photo here and being the first in the series and from the tweets listed the time fits with what bellingcat posted According to the bellingcat report this truck and trailer is the same red lowloader trailer as the one rebels were using on later occasions with only the phone banner removed in the later SBU video.
It may have been possible to spot minor scuffs and damage on different trucks trailers and buk systems but due to fuzzy photo i cannot make out any discrepancies in this photo of the truck parked and i doubt that professional photographer would take such a bad photo. It was taken on the h21 road just of the illicha ave roundabout and is directly across from the opel and chevrolet car dealerships using suncalc this photo seems to be taken 9.30 am to 10.00am see more on this photo-shopped buk
Makiiva
although there are no photos on the day of 17th the buk apparently made its way to makiiva. Bellingcat posted a collection of photos and a video stating that the stolen truck and trailer purported to be in and around the town of makiiva east of donetsk was being used by rebel fighters after the mh17 crash so it appears that the low loader and truck is still in the donetsk area however as you can see from the below photos its extremely difficult to confirm for sure that the makiiva trailer photos are the same as the the trailer carrying the buk unit above as the makiiva trailer has no phone banner on the side and the supposed satellite photo showing the alleged red trailer and truck was returned to the owner
Zurhes buk
a short video was released by the SBU showing this buk although was not as definitive because sun was weaker while the truck was recorded by the sbu according to bellingcat from the tweets of pro kiev supporters and ukrainian soldiers the time was 11.00=11.40am and to back up their claim the rebels had control of this they posted a photo and despite being just 50 meters away the image is quite blurry and of quite a distinctive truck purportedly belonging to the rebels date unknown ...i say this because the photo of the truck was taken at 10.00 though this photo will be the undoing of this story as you can see from the shadow on the pavement cast by the telephone pole the shadow closest to cameraman{green circle est} is slightly further east than at the base of the pole which indicates it is 10.am the same time as google images ...so what time did they go through!!!!!!
Torez buk
The photo of the torez buk allegedly on its way east on the morning of the 17th which appears to be the only genuine photo but this doesn't add up as it was actually posted to a message board on the 16th the post has since been deleted but it caused quite a response from users who appear to be pointing out that the plane went down the day after see here these buk were at those locations but they were of different times and probably while kiev controlled some of these placesthe below snapshots are from a filling station in torez h21 and using he suncalc app it shows that the photo was taken at 10.30 but no later than 10.45 for his reason the direct sunlight has not struck the wall of the building or the back of the truck side of the car and billboard as i will show an image search on google showed it was uploaded on the 17th by a user name of volodimir k and an image search led me to his other profiles on google plus and vk i now know this is volodimir karas and he is a member of the arsen avakov sponsored kyiv -2 volunteer group this group was deployed to slavyansk so i am very skeptical about how a member of an anti rebel group was able to freely move around rebel held torez and take this photo .
you can check suncalc here map of torez here and street view buk photo here
snizhne buk
Again using the suncalc page this photo could not have been taken at 1.00-1.30pm as stated by bellingcat because the side of the building facing the cameraman where the buk is has no sunlight being shone on it. And judging by the shadow at the base of the building from the fuzzy photo the SBU released it was taken at 10.00-am and as the suncalc suggests sun would strike the wall facing the cameraman at or shortly after 10.45 and estimated distance between buk and camera less than 50 meters. I used google map image as a comparison for the two centre photos of the buk and even though it is a low quality photo you can make out the shadow line.
luhansk buk
the SBU released a video of what the said was the rebel owned buk heading back the russia and according to the parismatch story published on the 25th july {edited on 29th} the SBU recorded this video in krasnadon this statement will be the undoing of kiev's cock and bull story. bellingcat set out to find the exact location which he did and it is not in rebel held krasnadon but it was in luhansk the video location is heading south east on pavlivska street and stepana razina st junction approaching Artemmivskyi district in western luhansk.
The official kiev story changed to coincide with the location being outed by bellingcat as not where they first said and as the livemap shows this area was under the control of the ukrainian so it is extremely unlikely that the rebels could or would drive their alleged buk through that area so this proves not only are the SBU lying but this buk is {if not a fabricated video} owned by the ukrainian army you can see this for yourself on the livemaps just type in the date in the menu bar.
the actual location is in lugansk not krasnadon you can copy/paste the exact location into your browser 48.545630, 39.264795
BUK 312 ACTUALLY BELONGS TO UKRAINIAN ARMY
Other photos and videos began to emerge showing that this buk unit was in the possession of the ukrainian army prior to the downing of mh17 . Buk 312 was based in luhansk according to a former crew member photo one is just south of luhansk in march 2014 and photo two is it being redeployed possibly kramatorsk . The crew member was reassigned to kramatorsk shortly after this photo he speaks here i'm not certain if he accompanied 312 in that 8th march convoy travelling {third buk in the line} on or before march 16th. another oversight by bellingcat and western countries is that ukraine army deployed 27 buk systems to the donetsk and luhansk region just prior to the july 17 mh17 shoot down. This is baffling as rebels had no aircraft.see ukrainian army's now deleted ATO promotional video here
Once these videos and photos were emerging in november and december that shows clearly that prior to mh17 shoot down buk 312 was in the possession of the ukrainian army and was apparently confirmed by the former crew member on buk 312 so the photo posted as the rebels buk is clearly false. The kiev government then claimed that it was ukrainian but that it had been seized by rebels when ukrainian army left it behind because it was non running and was used by the rebels just before the shoot down of mh17 And this is in direct conflict with their earlier statement and so called photographic proof that it was a russian supplied buk.
Their story was once again called into question {except by western governments and bellingcat} when a photo emerged towards the end of the year and apparently taken at the end of july from kramatorsk air base and apparently "verified" by bellingcat which is under ukrainian control showing buk 312 parked on the base and verified by bellingcat {????} .proving that it was not seized by rebels so was not in rebel hands at any time.
In early april 2015 social media users brought to light a short video showing buk 312 and buk 321 being transported by the ukrainian army. When challenged to give an explanation on this video eliot higgins blocked these social media users and he had the video deleted from youtube even though it does not breach the youtube TOS . The most recent upload of this video can be seen here
Below is buk 312 which was at first claimed to be the rebel owed buk being transported back to russia {pic 1} on 17/18th but after the video emerged showing it was known to be owned by the ukraine army and was later photographed at kramatorsk air base however as this blogpost states the night time photo was not taken on the 18th of july but it was in march four months earlier. There was two video made on that night video1 and video2
now it seems that the buk 3?2 is photographed in donetsk by an anonymous AP reporter which was then given to the parismatch reporters alfred m many of the news sites that quoted this AP reporter they don't mention their name this could be put down as concern for the safety of this ukrainian based reporter. But having gone through the tweets of the pro kiev supporters below i believe this reporter has little to fear
So it appears that the photo touted as proof that this buk was in rebel hands on the morning of 17th at 10.00 is dubious at best and "verified" by paris match calls into question their credibility. And despite not visiting ukraine or seeing the photographer i'm unsure how bellingcat manages to "verify"that the photo was taken on the morning of the 17th. And a deleted video {saved vid here} said to be 11.40 am {kiev time} was posted to youtube showing the alleged buk in zurhes east of donetsk the user goes by the name of Andrei and so posting the buk video appears to be the only activity on this account
However that account does list a pro kiev blogpage where he posts photo "evidence" which will be his undoing further down this blog when i show that the ukraine army owns this buk. Then a number of tweets were posted the first known twitter post i can find of this torez buk was posted by the pro kiev @euromaidan and is at 6.35 {14.35 UTC} here is a link to the tweet
Another "social media user who worked for ihor kolomoiski's privat bank ruslan navadyuk then posted this photo alleged to have been taken at approx 12.30 local time to the vk page of ukrainian miltary portal {UTAG} am {12.41 kiev time} then a video of the alleged buk in snizhne and was stated by bellingcat to be approx1.00- 1.30 However after using the suncalc webpage i found that this is incorrect the video appears to be much earlier at about 10.00 am so the buk in snizhne has no relation to the buk seen in donetsk-makiiva-shastorsk-torez as the photographed buk was making its way east from 9.30-1.00pm .
Exposing the lies peddled by kiev....how can a buk be in 4 locations within 30 minutes at about 10-10.30 am ironically the same time a google earth images and how can members of kyiv-2 post mh17 evidence 2 hour before the crash ????
The times are questionable especially considering the source
NOTE i discussed the suncalc versus the official story attributed to the kiev provided photos with eliott higgins only for him to scoff that "you do realize that 2 hours must be added to suncalc for time difference" well i am man enough to admit that i initially was wrong in stating that suncalc is based on local time it is not it is based on users location which for me is 0-utc {ireland/uk} but eliot higgins is also wrong when he stated local donbass time is +2 utc that added 2 hours applies to kiev only donbass is +3 hour utc so the below suncalc screen grabs are based on 0-utc and i will post local donbass time as " DT>><< "
Even this rebel buk theory but forward doesn't add up because how can the donetsk eastbound buk {09.30/10am utc DT12.00} be driven through snizhne 70km away at the same time {09.30/10am utc}. By all means call me a crank but prove me wrong !!!!! Using the suncalc app can you come up with a better explanation as to how these grainy photos despite being about 50 meters away from the cameraman still show the donetsk-zurhes-snizhne buk all appear to be at 09.30/10 am. Just type in the location and date you wish to view.
I have asked eliot to give me an explanation on this photo-shopped buk on seven occasions however he has yet to give an answer
>>>>>update ..he simply said it's not photo-shopped end of discussion :} <<<<
so a summary of the below photos officially stated by kiev and western governments as the locations and times this buk was apparently in rebel hands. How can they be of the same buk on the same day over a 70km distance and taken over a 60 minute time frame a fast car would find it a stretch to achieve this feat. The public {you} are expected to be as thick as crap to believe this cock and bull story peddled by kiev
suncalc just type in the date and location and satellite top right of the page
the donetsk buk site 48.004560, 37.872778 and image link
the zurhres buk site 48.016784, 38.301387 and image link
the torez buk site 48.024438, 38.615409 and image link
the snizhne buk site 48.014633, 38.763674 and image link
journey time journalist max van der werff posted a video [oct 2015} of the estimated journey time in a minibus and at an average speed of 70/80 kmh the journey from the first location in donetsk to torez of buk photos took 1.20 hours so the journey from donetsk to snizhne is estimated to be 1.40 hours by minibus to snizhne The same journey taken by a truck carrying a buk missile launcher would take approx 2 hours however according to the photos freely available on the net and using suncalc to estimate the time each photo was taken the apparent trailer mounted rebel buk covered this distance in less than 30 mins ...the story simply does not add up
the header on photo 2 is when it was first posted on the 16th and as donbass time is 11 hours ahead of google head quarters in san francisco i am only stating that for google to have the post listing on the 16th it cannot be posted to the internet any later than 11am UTC on the morning of the 17th 2hours and 20 minutes before mh17 was shot down at 13.20 UTC
and is clearly seen in the google listing this post states MH17 in the post whoever posted this knew something about the mh17 crash 2 hours beforehand which can only mean that this was pre-planned attack on mh17 if "evidence" of the mh17 attack was posted beforehand ......which part of this is confusing to pro kiev supporters .......toterman only lists one forum thread starter
even though this is photo-shopped i will still include it to show that kiev are lying and their story simply doesn't add up
The first sighting of the alleged mh 17 and after david clinch contacted parismatch for information about the photo and it was confirmed by them that this donetsk buk photo was "given" to @AdeMontesquiou by an anonymous reporter and was not taken by {alfred de montesquiou } as many pro kiev claim see the parismatch story these anonymous reporters told alfred de montesquiou that they spoke to the truck driver and they had broad russian federation accents .
I have a few issues with this version of events firstly why would alleged russian buk personnel who are supposed to be in the country covertly even stop to speak to local reporters and secondly if they did have time to speak to the driver how come they only managed to get a ridiculously bad drive by photo. and given that we now know what pavel aleynikov was doing in the area its possibly that it was pavel who took the photo of the truck and trailer while it was transporting a damaged apc and the buk was later photo-shopped into the photo which was taken while he was driving past it
The photo of the truck that was making its way to makiiva and as you can see from the photo the shadow cast by the buk the time is approx 10.00 am but no later than 10.30 and as you can see from the panoramic view the shadow is falling towards the opel dealership just across the road from this slipway where the buk was parked approx where the road sweeper is. I encourage anyone to view the street view and use the suncalc and see the buk photo here and being the first in the series and from the tweets listed the time fits with what bellingcat posted According to the bellingcat report this truck and trailer is the same red lowloader trailer as the one rebels were using on later occasions with only the phone banner removed in the later SBU video.
It may have been possible to spot minor scuffs and damage on different trucks trailers and buk systems but due to fuzzy photo i cannot make out any discrepancies in this photo of the truck parked and i doubt that professional photographer would take such a bad photo. It was taken on the h21 road just of the illicha ave roundabout and is directly across from the opel and chevrolet car dealerships using suncalc this photo seems to be taken 9.30 am to 10.00am see more on this photo-shopped buk
Makiiva
although there are no photos on the day of 17th the buk apparently made its way to makiiva. Bellingcat posted a collection of photos and a video stating that the stolen truck and trailer purported to be in and around the town of makiiva east of donetsk was being used by rebel fighters after the mh17 crash so it appears that the low loader and truck is still in the donetsk area however as you can see from the below photos its extremely difficult to confirm for sure that the makiiva trailer photos are the same as the the trailer carrying the buk unit above as the makiiva trailer has no phone banner on the side and the supposed satellite photo showing the alleged red trailer and truck was returned to the owner
Zurhes buk
a short video was released by the SBU showing this buk although was not as definitive because sun was weaker while the truck was recorded by the sbu according to bellingcat from the tweets of pro kiev supporters and ukrainian soldiers the time was 11.00=11.40am and to back up their claim the rebels had control of this they posted a photo and despite being just 50 meters away the image is quite blurry and of quite a distinctive truck purportedly belonging to the rebels date unknown ...i say this because the photo of the truck was taken at 10.00 though this photo will be the undoing of this story as you can see from the shadow on the pavement cast by the telephone pole the shadow closest to cameraman{green circle est} is slightly further east than at the base of the pole which indicates it is 10.am the same time as google images ...so what time did they go through!!!!!!
The photo of the torez buk allegedly on its way east on the morning of the 17th which appears to be the only genuine photo but this doesn't add up as it was actually posted to a message board on the 16th the post has since been deleted but it caused quite a response from users who appear to be pointing out that the plane went down the day after see here these buk were at those locations but they were of different times and probably while kiev controlled some of these placesthe below snapshots are from a filling station in torez h21 and using he suncalc app it shows that the photo was taken at 10.30 but no later than 10.45 for his reason the direct sunlight has not struck the wall of the building or the back of the truck side of the car and billboard as i will show an image search on google showed it was uploaded on the 17th by a user name of volodimir k and an image search led me to his other profiles on google plus and vk i now know this is volodimir karas and he is a member of the arsen avakov sponsored kyiv -2 volunteer group this group was deployed to slavyansk so i am very skeptical about how a member of an anti rebel group was able to freely move around rebel held torez and take this photo .
you can check suncalc here map of torez here and street view buk photo here
snizhne buk
Again using the suncalc page this photo could not have been taken at 1.00-1.30pm as stated by bellingcat because the side of the building facing the cameraman where the buk is has no sunlight being shone on it. And judging by the shadow at the base of the building from the fuzzy photo the SBU released it was taken at 10.00-am and as the suncalc suggests sun would strike the wall facing the cameraman at or shortly after 10.45 and estimated distance between buk and camera less than 50 meters. I used google map image as a comparison for the two centre photos of the buk and even though it is a low quality photo you can make out the shadow line.
the SBU released a video of what the said was the rebel owned buk heading back the russia and according to the parismatch story published on the 25th july {edited on 29th} the SBU recorded this video in krasnadon this statement will be the undoing of kiev's cock and bull story. bellingcat set out to find the exact location which he did and it is not in rebel held krasnadon but it was in luhansk the video location is heading south east on pavlivska street and stepana razina st junction approaching Artemmivskyi district in western luhansk.
The official kiev story changed to coincide with the location being outed by bellingcat as not where they first said and as the livemap shows this area was under the control of the ukrainian so it is extremely unlikely that the rebels could or would drive their alleged buk through that area so this proves not only are the SBU lying but this buk is {if not a fabricated video} owned by the ukrainian army you can see this for yourself on the livemaps just type in the date in the menu bar.
the actual location is in lugansk not krasnadon you can copy/paste the exact location into your browser 48.545630, 39.264795
BUK 312 ACTUALLY BELONGS TO UKRAINIAN ARMY
Other photos and videos began to emerge showing that this buk unit was in the possession of the ukrainian army prior to the downing of mh17 . Buk 312 was based in luhansk according to a former crew member photo one is just south of luhansk in march 2014 and photo two is it being redeployed possibly kramatorsk . The crew member was reassigned to kramatorsk shortly after this photo he speaks here i'm not certain if he accompanied 312 in that 8th march convoy travelling {third buk in the line} on or before march 16th. another oversight by bellingcat and western countries is that ukraine army deployed 27 buk systems to the donetsk and luhansk region just prior to the july 17 mh17 shoot down. This is baffling as rebels had no aircraft.see ukrainian army's now deleted ATO promotional video here
Once these videos and photos were emerging in november and december that shows clearly that prior to mh17 shoot down buk 312 was in the possession of the ukrainian army and was apparently confirmed by the former crew member on buk 312 so the photo posted as the rebels buk is clearly false. The kiev government then claimed that it was ukrainian but that it had been seized by rebels when ukrainian army left it behind because it was non running and was used by the rebels just before the shoot down of mh17 And this is in direct conflict with their earlier statement and so called photographic proof that it was a russian supplied buk.
Their story was once again called into question {except by western governments and bellingcat} when a photo emerged towards the end of the year and apparently taken at the end of july from kramatorsk air base and apparently "verified" by bellingcat which is under ukrainian control showing buk 312 parked on the base and verified by bellingcat {????} .proving that it was not seized by rebels so was not in rebel hands at any time.
In early april 2015 social media users brought to light a short video showing buk 312 and buk 321 being transported by the ukrainian army. When challenged to give an explanation on this video eliot higgins blocked these social media users and he had the video deleted from youtube even though it does not breach the youtube TOS . The most recent upload of this video can be seen here
Below is buk 312 which was at first claimed to be the rebel owed buk being transported back to russia {pic 1} on 17/18th but after the video emerged showing it was known to be owned by the ukraine army and was later photographed at kramatorsk air base however as this blogpost states the night time photo was not taken on the 18th of july but it was in march four months earlier. There was two video made on that night video1 and video2
...
A new suspect buk must be found
Unfazed by these new developments that the ukrainian army are blatantly lying pro ukrainians ,western governments and bellingcat claimed that the entire buk 312 story that rebels owned that system in the first place was in fact a russian propaganda exercise despite the fact the ukraine army were the ones who released photos and claimed rebels had control of 312 but now want to distance buk 312 from the entire mh17 situation and are adamant that they have the "real mh17" buk pinned down.
so in the aftermath of the buk 312 being outed as owned by the ukrainian army pro kiev sources began posting photos of what they claimed was the "real" buk system that the rebels used to shoot it down. A wide range of buk systems were put forward as the "rebel owned" buk such as buk 313,,321,,333,,122,,223,,and a number of other obscure units from russia. Having learnt their lesson on buk312 they appear to have checked that these units could not be traced back to ukrainian army before settling on a conveniently obscure buk that had the number partially painted over
According to bellingcat and the SBU the russian army provided the rebels with a buk anti aircraft missile system and posted a photo purportedly from mid to late june 2014 and have a tag number of 3?2 { i cannot make out tag number from this photo} which the osce did not report crossing any border posts they are monitoring below is the supposed russian supplied buk while it was still in russia there is no known photos of this unit allegedly being in ukraine until bellingcat posts photo from the morning off july 17th.
And according to the ukrainian SBU and stated on web page DELFI it was transported across the russian border around the town of shucodolsk at 1.00 am on july 17th and sent to donetsk. From here it was allegedly sent to >pervomaisk< there may be some confusion on exact spelling or a typo i will update the destination as there are two possible locations village settlement of >pervomais'ke< is approx 12km northwest of donetsk and the stated location of >pervomaisk< is a town approx 100 km north east of donetsk.
now it seems that the buk 3?2 is photographed in donetsk by an anonymous AP reporter which was then given to the parismatch reporters alfred m many of the news sites that quoted this AP reporter they don't mention their name this could be put down as concern for the safety of this ukrainian based reporter. But having gone through the tweets of the pro kiev supporters below i believe this reporter has little to fear
1nobody has come forward {apart from kiev military further down the page} to say that they seen the telltale signs of a buk such as the contrail these leave.here is the crash video i see no contrail anywhere in the shot http://youtu.be/mrDqxaSSdp0 And no recorded witnesses in snizhne *pop* 48.000 {pre war} torez *pop*80.000 {pre-war} and only one alleged anonymous witness.And no witnesses from the number of towns along the supposed route of all 3 possible buk launch sites east of torez ,snizhne or east of grabova And you can view a buk training video where you can see that these things are big {18ft} and loud it would be difficult to miss one being near your town
2 witnesses stated that they heard a number of explosions in the sky a number of them stated that after the explosions they saw the bodies and wreckage falling from the sky and saw a smaller military plane flying away from the source of the explosions the bbc --al jazeera and number of other news interviewed them shortly after the crash the bbc deleted their own story from their website once it was at odds with the official western narrative that it was a buk missile fired by the rebels so i have to wonder how a buk missile managed to explode more than once supporters of the junta and bellingcat claims that these people must have been coached by the russian fsb as it was western journalist that were to first to speak to these people i seriously doubt the FSB played any role in these witness accounts
2 witnesses stated that they heard a number of explosions in the sky a number of them stated that after the explosions they saw the bodies and wreckage falling from the sky and saw a smaller military plane flying away from the source of the explosions the bbc --al jazeera and number of other news interviewed them shortly after the crash the bbc deleted their own story from their website once it was at odds with the official western narrative that it was a buk missile fired by the rebels so i have to wonder how a buk missile managed to explode more than once supporters of the junta and bellingcat claims that these people must have been coached by the russian fsb as it was western journalist that were to first to speak to these people i seriously doubt the FSB played any role in these witness accounts
Click photos to see the eyewitness accounts
3 As plane was heading south east and two of the buk sites are south of the crash site then surely the primary damage should be on right hand side of the plane. Bellingcats northern suspected buk launch site could be a candidate however the damage patterns dont seem to add up there is highly focused damage on the cockpit. See also the left hand side wing tip in the below photo which shows directional damage leading to cockpit area.
Buk radar guided missiles have a 70kg warhead and dont actually strike their target they explode from 5-20 meters from the target scattering shrapnel in all directions. But tight grouping on the holes at the cockpit window suggests that the buk would have to be 2/3 feet away which throws up another question why is the hole so small 70kg of explosives can destroy armored vehicles but commercial aircraft are of a light metal. And despite the crash site being searched a number of times no missile parts have yet been found no rocket moter/fins or any bodywork of a buk these things are 18 foot long and weigh over 700kg surely some parts have been reported to be found. you can see more information on damage patterns from this paris match segment on buk damage
other very suspect damage on the plane is direction impact damage on the wing and quite uniform focused small holes right at the cockpit the majority of the holes appear to be about 25-30 mm leading a substantial number of people to comment that it cannon fire damage which many now suspect that a fighter plane may be the culprit
6 The united states has asserted many times they have a substantial amount of evidence proving rebels shot down mh17 when challenged to produce it they were evasive saying they had "sources" many believe these sources are in fact eliot higgins {bellingcat} and pro ukrainian supporters at @euromaidan but they didn't even present that.
And according to the russian military the united states actually had two AWACS planes flying directly over the the area at the time of downing of mh17 russia requested the us release the data from these AWACS they didn't provide it. Instead on the 27th july they provided a grainy photo of alleged russian grad attacks on ukraine which is completely irrelevant to the mh17 crash
And according to the russian military the united states actually had two AWACS planes flying directly over the the area at the time of downing of mh17 russia requested the us release the data from these AWACS they didn't provide it. Instead on the 27th july they provided a grainy photo of alleged russian grad attacks on ukraine which is completely irrelevant to the mh17 crash
A suspected fighter plane attack
in the immediate aftermath of the attack kiev held a press conference in which they stated that they had no aircraft operating in the area which an odd statement as at that time nobody knew what happened instead everyone was already on the theory of "rebel owned buk" kiev also stated that it was impossible that one of their planes shot down mh17 as they had grounded all their planes on monday 3 days prior this is a tissue of lies because rebels had shot down a number of lower flying aircraft on monday {1},,tuesday{1} wednesday{1},,thursday{1} friday{2}
In an effort to reinforce the rebel buk theory many pro kiev supporters and the bellingcat investigation branded an attack on mh17 by an su25 as impossible because he maximum height an su25 can reach is 7000 meters so it couldn't even reach mh17 and provided the wikipedia page as the proof and as the estimated height mh17 was attacked was around ten thousand meters
This is blatant lies because the su25 wikipedia page was edited prior to the attack to put the service ceiling as 7000 meters but the same page has the service ceiling listed as 10.000 meters as far back as 2005 click photos for the page as it was on the dates
On the 26 december 2011 the service height of the su25 was edited and lowered to 7000 meters by a user by the name of fnlayson he appears to list another wikipedia page that was posted on a bulletin board as his source and doesn't appear to be based on hard facts. The russian tv network russia today also picked up on this subject and conducted a test to see if the su25 can reach 10.000 meters and pilots of the su25 say it can reach 10.000 meters so fnlayson is clearly wrong with his assessment so where he got the figure of 7000 meters is baffling
To get to the truth behind MH17 these men need to be questioned as they were based around the area of the crash at the time. Pro kiev supporters and volunteers battalion supporters went to a lot of trouble to both hide their activities and identities at the time by erasing videos, photos, and news articles and web links
The tragic events of flight mh17 were already a whitewash with claims and counter claims .i will be posting here why i strongly believe those linked to the kiev government of poroshenko is behind the attack and why...A deliberate attack in an effort to get nato into ukraine . Given the tissue of lies the kiev government are willing to spout and the fact they have tried to hide the videos showing they were in the area at the time and they had their street army in right sector get videos deleted from youtube as well a creating false SM pages as well as getting others banned i doubt it was an accident i will post events from the maidan coup through to the attack on mh17 and look at some of the key players. Some will question what the maidan has to do with mh17 however it is to show the brutal and thuggish nature of those who now rule ukraine. They took control of ukraine by force of arms when their democratic effort were a complete failure some of those ruling kiev now received minimal share of votes in 2012 elections ranging from 0.1% to 3-4% and not surprisingly were getting 30-40% of votes after the coup once large sections of ukraine were blocked from voting as well as voter intimidation in the areas they would later control so you can clearly see they have absolutely no mandate to rule all ukraine. if they are only too happy to kill protesters on the maidan and obliterate ukrainian cities to get what they want do you really think they would give a rats ass about some foreigners on a plane
the key figures i believe shot down mh17 believing it was putin's plane
arsen avakov is the current minister for internal affairs who came to office after the maidan coup an oligarch from karkiv and is a chief financier of the azov {Andriy beletski} and donbass {semen semechenko} battalions during the coup he was at the maidan and was part of the fatherland party along with yulia timoshenko appointed to the office of minister of internal affairs in february 2014 in the immediate aftermath of the maidan before joining the peoples from party. He was charged with illegally transferring land and arrested in italy . However criminality and thuggery isn't new to avakov back in 2010 in was attacking immigrants and seizing businesses in karkiv according to this article . Despite the suits and new lofty title of minister of internal affairs he is a murderous warlord.Many falsely believe that president petro poroshenko is the man who runs ukraine but make no mistake it is arsen avakov who pulls the strings and with the use of his volunteer battalions and right sector street army keeps ukrainian politicians and generals in check with threats of and actual murders
Look at the events prior to to the crash when arseniy yatsenyuk seized power with the help of right sector a far right fascist group trained by nato by shooting both police and maidan protesters showing that they have no problem shooting unarmed people to get what they want. Upon taking government they began to purge government buildings as well as the military of non supporters of svoboda political party..as well as any politicians from russian speaking east ukraine .btw the current junta was not elected by the people of ukraine they were "elected" by the svoboda party. Also any free press or any press that didn't become a mouth piece for the new government here is svoboda party member threatening news boss and beating anyone one who disagrees with the party
He was recorded pepper spraying a journalist and as you will see he mixes with some seriously unsavory characters including neo-nazis foreign mercenaries and even the maidan snipers which he financed A leaked phone call from EU officials and the fact that avakovs right hand man being caught red handed with sniper rifles at the maidan{shown further down the page} appears to support the suspicion that he was involved he was before and still is a gangster and a warlord despite his lofty new title.
Just one month after the overthrow of the democratically elected government avakov ordered the start of an "anti terrorist operation" against the people of karkiv who were protesting about the overthrow of the government and they would not be supporting the new regime i guess it was perfectly fine for him to firebomb police and massacre both police and protesters but is not ok for people to hold actual peaceful protests against an illegal government. Although i don't know how accurate it is you can see a timeline of events from march to may it must be said that the new coup government did try to defuse the tensions in the east ukraine and new kiev junta proposed that all armed groups that took part in the maidan should be disbanded
East ukrainians proposed that they should have more say in tax revenue he right to have russian as an official second language {over half of ukrainians speak russian}. However it was oligarchs such as avakov who in their scramble to seize state owned business and assets who told the new kiev leadership to flat out reject all proposals coming from east ukraine and out of fear of the oligarchs who financed them and fear of losing the lucrative industrial east stated {in russian} that if east ukrainians want to speak russian they should piss off to russia.
The oligarchs using there newly created and now armed with stolen military weapons volunteer groups such as azov battalion--donbass battalion--kyiv-1and 2 units national guard as well as a number of others more than 30 as of today these groups were ordered to sow mayhem throughout ukraine while they galvanized their power in the wake of the maidan coup these volunteer groups stated they would cleanse ukraine of the moscal invaders and separatists {anyone who didn't support the new junta} and they carried out a number of attacks throughout ukraine
The new junta and their hired thugs in the volunteer units wasted no time "cleansing" ukraine of their fellow ukrainian "invaders" the tipping point was at the start of may when dozens of people were burned and beaten to death at the start of may in odessa trade union building shooting of civilians in mariupol as well as a number of attacks as seen in the below videos
So sick of being attacked by the oligarch financed right sector and and fledgling volunteer groups the people in east ukraine held a referendum to become independent and despite a number of failed attacks on protesters it was an overwhelming success from independence voters. These oligarch funded thugs having failed to suppress the will of the people went back to kiev humiliated then stated they would return with the ukraine army to crush these separatists and russian invaders but again the citizens stood up to this assault from the new junta
Thats when people from the east set up self defense forces because they didn't support the overthrow of the government of viktor yanukovych and fearing an all out assault on east ukraine and the now clear agenda of kiev namely the eviction of all east ukrainians so a number of ukrainian servicemen who lived in eastern ukraine set up local defense forces which would later become the novorossiya armed forces {NAF} kiev began shelling eastern cities .....well you get picture of what arsen avakov and his hired thugs are about.
While in government they have a number of times asked nato and european union to send troops to help with this "cleansing" this has so far been refused as firstly ukraine is not in nato and secondly the EU dont want to be associated with the evicion of the local population. But that didn't stop western leaders sending cash and equipment to the keiv junta in an effort to kick off a conflict between russia and nato clearly for their own benefit. Kiev has attacked russian territory over 20 times to date as well as a raft of sanctions by the west despite critical views from russians putin has not been bated into crossing the border.
He instead chose to back rebel fighters with weapons and cash as the west has been doing for ukraine ...Frustrated by this the junta has stepped up attacks on the east shelling wildly into the cities as well as deliberately targeting russian journalists and and issuing death threats to russian affiliates ...still russian troops didn't cross the border..At the start of july 2014 arsen avakov oversaw the deployment of donbass and azov battalions as well as the newly formed national guard which is comprised of maidan "protesters" into eastern ukraine the equipment that was brought with them heavy artillery tanks and buk m1 missiles as the rebels have no aircraft you would have to wonder why.
he had members of these volunteer battalions post "evidence" namely photos the internet chat rooms twitter accounts and youtube accounts but it seems the men jumped the gun as some of this evidence was posted the day before as well as far to soon after the attack on mh17 to be believed...They also screwed up when in an effort to put the "smoking gun" namely a buk system into the hands of the rebels by posting a number of photos and and videos to the internet of what would later be identified as actually belonging to the ukrainian so this proves that this was a pre-planned attack
But i dont believe a passenger plane was the target it was the plane of vladymir putin that he was after. Later when in a webcam discussion with somebody about the subject of mh 17 and it was put to him that he was suspected of involvement ihor kolomioski laughed it of and said he had nothing to do with it he said "they" shot the wrong plane although it's not clear who he meant be "they". Somebody with clout was able to get flight mh17 directed to fly 200km outside their normal flight route and why would avakov and his merry band of recently released convicts be bringing anti-aircraft missiles to fight the rebels when the rebels have not one single aircraft
andryi beletski is the commander of azov brigade and has links to arsen avakov from karkiv fiercely anti russian and took part in the ukraine without kuchma a precursor to the orange revolution. In 2002 Biletsky became a leader of the Kharkiv branch of Tryzub of Stepan Bandera political organization which is precursor to "right sector" and beletski is the overall leader in the east ukraine region. ..in 2006 he ran unsuccessfully in the local elections in karkiv {pop1,430,885} in 2011 he along with others were charged with a string of murders in december 2013 he was providing right sector security for oleh lyashko and after the maidan coup in 2014 lyashko signed a decree saying these men were "political prisoners" and all members of right sector and affiliate groups were released from prison some of whom were serving sentences for murder. However in 2014 he ran for political office again and with his thugs in right sector standing outside polling stations and stopping suspected "enemies and separatists" of right sector from voting as well as searching trough ballot boxes and destroying rival votes he still only managed to get 33% of votes {31.000}
maidan sniper {name unknown}
having seen this man in a number photos with arsen avakov i felt that i seen him before so browsed through videos surrounding the events of the maidan and sure enough there he was. he was caught on camera leaving or arriving to maidan square on march 7th 2014 and had his car stopped by maidan protesters for a short time and in the boot was a number of silenced rifles after speaking to one of the masked passengers {driver didn't speak} sergei pashinky appeared to tell protesters to allow them to leave
however this man may be a non ukrainian/russian speaker as when he was getting back into the driving seat one of the protesters spoke to him followed by "slava ukraine" a common chant on the maidan but the man stared blankly at him as though he had no idea what was said. This man can be seen in a number of later photos with arsen avakov and also a national guard promo vid and could well be a member of the stepan polorak led national guard he is mainly seen with avakov while in the area of the "ATO" and the karkiv area he is circled red and sergei pashinky is circled yellow see maidan checkpoint video here
having seen this man in a number photos with arsen avakov i felt that i seen him before so browsed through videos surrounding the events of the maidan and sure enough there he was. he was caught on camera leaving or arriving to maidan square on march 7th 2014 and had his car stopped by maidan protesters for a short time and in the boot was a number of silenced rifles after speaking to one of the masked passengers {driver didn't speak} sergei pashinky appeared to tell protesters to allow them to leave
however this man may be a non ukrainian/russian speaker as when he was getting back into the driving seat one of the protesters spoke to him followed by "slava ukraine" a common chant on the maidan but the man stared blankly at him as though he had no idea what was said. This man can be seen in a number of later photos with arsen avakov and also a national guard promo vid and could well be a member of the stepan polorak led national guard he is mainly seen with avakov while in the area of the "ATO" and the karkiv area he is circled red and sergei pashinky is circled yellow see maidan checkpoint video here
Two photos that were taken and said to be the in the immediate moments after the crash and purportedly from an anonymous witness who i later found out to be pavel aleynikov {UKRAINIAN ARMY} who stated that he took both of these photos within 10-20 seconds photo with the black smoke is the impact site of mh17 north of his apartment and photo 2 is what he said was the buk vapor trail east of torez to the south of his apartment bloc
Pavel then claimed in a interview with the media that he went and handed the photo {sim card} to his friend vladymir djukov who uploaded them to twitter 15 minutes after the crash before passing it on to the SBU and the SBU compensated him for the sim card. However vladymir {ukrainie army} was deployed in Amvrosievka 50km and when contacted by dutch investigators he gave them his camera to them why would he do this as the photos are on the sim card
And to date pavel is the only known "eyewitness" to a buk being launched of the thousands of ukraine and rebels engaged in battle around suar mohyla not a single one ever reported seeing a buk or any other anti aircraft missile being fired
Pavel also uploads his photography work to many sites under the name rescuero.ru to sites like websta rescuero and from what i gather from his work he has very high quality cameras as seen on panoramio profile bellingcat never said what type of camera that was used to take the buk contrail photo however going through pavel's work i suspect it was a nikon d7000 that he had at time time or a nikon d5100
SUSPECTED SOUTHERN BUK SITES
I am aware that the videos show the saur mohyla monument and not the site i have marked but it's clear this area was under attack throughout july. Yellow diamond marker could be the area pavel refers to when he tweeted "black smoke visible west of saur tomb"
The below videos were posted to youtube on the 3rd and 5th july camera viewpoint is most likely the same location from where a bbc russia reporter covered the so called buk launch where she interviews eyewitnesses ...It is inline with the marked photos and is the approximate distance to saur mohyla and in the video you can see a stand out tree as with the bbc report which is a short distance to pavel aleynikov's apartment if anyone can provide an alternate location i would consider it
A number of photos were widely distributed of the buk contrail proving rebels shot down mh 17 and all were taken by anonymous witness but as we know now it is pavel aleynikov and in his account he states that he took the photos from either or both his balcony and the roof of his apartment block within a few minutes of the crash of mh17 on the 17th pavel is lying through his teeth because the smoke plume is not from a buk missile he says was fired on the 17th {13.20uc} it is from a grad and artillery strike carried out on the area of suar mogila
Pavel's own tweets posted just prior the mh17 attack {13.20utc} confirms that this "buk contrail" photo is of a grad artillery strike {click for link to tweets} here {4.53 minutes before attack}
link to tweet here {3.49 minutes before attack}
link to tweet here {1.03 minutes before attack}
picture 1 is one of those shared as the "buk contrail" orange line to the source of the smoke
picture 2 i have rotated the overview of the area from where pavel took the photo the red line is towards a mound of a sand/dirt ..blue line towards a number of trees ..green line is towards the mineworks
picture 3 is a brightened and magnified image shared by bellingcat {from his page}
picture 4 is a more panoramic image
image 5 an corrected image overview as seen on google maps and shows to where lines leads too
image 6 a zoomed out view to include the direction of the source of the smoke plume it is along the route of the orange line but not outside purple lines source appears to be beyond treeline at first two blue stars ..smoke plume is within the area of the six stars
image 7 is the area i suspect is the source of this smoke plume in the yellow diamond
image 8 is the site south of snizhne and north of the saur mogila tower monument and you can clearly see the area is heavily damaged
I am aware that the videos show the saur mohyla monument and not the site i have marked but it's clear this area was under attack throughout july. Yellow diamond marker could be the area pavel refers to when he tweeted "black smoke visible west of saur tomb"
The below videos were posted to youtube on the 3rd and 5th july camera viewpoint is most likely the same location from where a bbc russia reporter covered the so called buk launch where she interviews eyewitnesses ...It is inline with the marked photos and is the approximate distance to saur mohyla and in the video you can see a stand out tree as with the bbc report which is a short distance to pavel aleynikov's apartment if anyone can provide an alternate location i would consider it
As part of their "proof" kiev ,,bellingcat and western media published the buk plume photo as proof and bellingcat later published photos of russian satellite photos which he put through the online site photo forensics to "prove russians are lying" this photo has nothing to do with the mh17 buk plume but this will be bellingcats undoing
The owner of the site Dr. Neal Krawetz was asked what he thought of bellingcat's conclusion on the photo to which he was less than complimentary on his analysis and twitter users asked neal krawetz to look at the buk plume photo to which he stated that after examining it the buk plume photo bellingcat has used as part of his proof is very heavily altered see the tweet in question by clicking the image. It is becoming more obvious {except to bellingcat} that kiev have put out a substantial amount of false information
The owner of the site Dr. Neal Krawetz was asked what he thought of bellingcat's conclusion on the photo to which he was less than complimentary on his analysis and twitter users asked neal krawetz to look at the buk plume photo to which he stated that after examining it the buk plume photo bellingcat has used as part of his proof is very heavily altered see the tweet in question by clicking the image. It is becoming more obvious {except to bellingcat} that kiev have put out a substantial amount of false information
so either the buk contrail "evidence" is from 5th july or from pavels tweets abou a grad attack 4 hours before mh17 was shot down his own tweets prove that he never witnessed or heard a buk being fired at 13.20 ...What he did see was an artillery strike at saur mohyla 4 hours prior to the mh17 attack and is currently telling a pack of lies when he {the only recorded witness to a buk launch} in order to reinforce the SBU cock and bull story and making a mockery of the victims
The dutch safety board have never even interviewed pavel much less asked him to take a polygraph test which is a massive disservice to the victims of this pre-planned murder of 298 people
the "witness" who supposedly seen the buk in torez When i google searched the images for "buk in torez" an image that showed the image listed on google street view {deleted soon after i published blog} as posted on the 17th july by "volodymir k" and was the earliest post however the only activity on google streetview account is the photo that he uploaded on the 17th. google image searches led me to his vk volodimir karas page twitter and google plus accounts so i am certain its the same man Here is his google plus page he is a member of battalion kyiv-2 an extremist pro kiev unit well known for their brutality also with links to pravy sektor and was on the maidan from at least december you can check out his facebook page a google search of his twitter and other pages showed a suspect message board post which was posted on a russian page named holywars which was posted and listed on google as posted on the 16th july the day before mh17 it was quickly deleted but it caused a deluge of comments pointing out that how was he posting "proof" of mh17 shoot down a day before it happened
The upload date cannot be explained away by google time difference as google is based in san francisco which is -8 hrs UTC and donbass is +3hrs UTC and as mh17 crashed at 13.20 UTC that post could not be listed later than 11am UTC so how could this man post evidence that rebels had a buk in Torez 2hours and 20 minutes before the crash if this buk really was photographed in torez it could not be later than 11.am UTC to show as being as posted on 16th as google hq is 11 hours behind donbas unless the buk doubled back to zurhes as it was allegedly seen in zurhes at 11.30-11.45
pages created to sow misinformation
pages created to sow misinformation
how could the rebels have possession of a buk that was at a ukrainian army buk deployment a week later
On june 29th a tweet was posted by an apparently pro rebel twitter page @dnrpress which had become quite popular with those who support the rebel fighters. The user of this page was tweeting a high number of tweets per day and quickly gained a lot of followers {over 54 thousand} as it seemed to be keeping people up to date on news from east ukraine on attacks the status of the militia and political figures. And also putting out defamatory tweets about junta leaders which seemed to be popular with the followers. However i view this page with suspicion for a few reasons i have yet to hear any pro rebel tweeters ever referring to the conflict as an ATO as dnr press has done on a number of tweets from tweets i have seen from both sides it is only westerners and pro junta supporters who call it an ATO. Of course this could be dismissed as a touch of paranoia on my part but when brought into the context of mh17 and the only tweet from a "pro rebel" twitter account apparently lending support to western theory that rebels shot down mh17 may not be so far fetched.
while reading an article on business insider on so called eyewitness accounts they list a tweet by radio24-ua and say it's the buk in snizhne screen grabbed a tweet from @dnrpress 29th june which states that rebels have a buk and was widely shared by pro ukraine supporters on the 17th july although i only know of @robpulsenews being the first to { tweet it 9.56am 17.56 UTC} and @Euromaidan_pr tweeted it at 10.06 =16.06 UTC it was Then screen grabbed and shared by a pro ukr army vkpage 16.07 utc and ukraine reporter @stateofukraine their posted tweet 10.12=16.12 utc and the listed on @radio24_ua {10.34am-17th} is possible the page was to sow misinformation
But as you will see it looks nothing like the "MH17 rebel owned buk" later peddled by bellingcat and kiev as it has no radar mounted so i have got to ask what is the deal with dnrpress posting this and later deleting a photo of ukrainian army buk that was deployed a few days later north of slavyansk as i will show in the below tweets and videos ??? and surprisingly bellingcat ignores it in his report
but as we know and was confirmed by kiev rebels NEVER captured any buk units from the ukrainian army despite what ukraine reporter tweet has stated and bellingcats apparent rebel owned buk was only delivered to the rebels the same day as the shoot down according to the SBU so why was an apparent rebel supporting twitter page lying that rebels had this unit in snizhne ....was he laying the groundwork for an attack on a civilian plane. And there appears to be a second page connected to this page @dnrpresscentr and a youtube channel both twitter accounts and the youtube were abandoned in mid august although it may be possible all 3 accounts are unrelated as the only connection is their similar "dnrpress"user names
click below photo for the ukraine army video
While browsing through the pro kiev www.livemaps.ua hosted by the interpretermag they had an interactive map where you could see the daily updates about the war in ukraine so i typed the 17th and in he corner of the page there was a tweet posted on the same day in which oleg tyagnibok tweeted "100% confirmed terrorist shot from churnokino" {just west of debaltsevo} does this tweet confirm my suspicions that it was in fact the ukraine army that shot down mh17 i screen grabbed it but as i did an extremely odd thing happened the site immediately went dead when i refreshed the page the page was no longer there although it is still on the interpretermag page all information about the pinned locations is now gone i will try it again later {yellow x is chernuhinskoho} did he accidentally drop the ukrainian army in it as that location was under ukr army control
Another set of unexplained items on mh17
in the
aftermath of the crash while everyone was still wondering what happened the
kiev army held a press conference which they stated that they had no aircraft
deployed in the area at the time. Firstly this an odd thing to say as nobody
even mentioned the possibility that kiev airforce shot it down at that
time.Secondly this statement is at odds with the statement of a ukrainian soldier
that told his story in december in which he states that a number of su25 took
off from dnepropetrovsk airbase.
He also
stated that one of the ukraine army su25 was armed with air to air missiles
{likely R-60 Aphid} and again i remind people that the rebels had no aircraft
so this is quite odd.and that when the su25 that had the A-2-A missiles
returned it no longer had these missiles. And a number of ukrainian air force planes were shot down on the14th- 16th-17th-and 19th july and video proof to show the downed planes so clearly kiev are lying again
As ukrainian su25 was attacking torez on the 15th july and rebels shot
down a number of low flying aircraft both fixed wing and helicopters throughout
ukrainian assault from may and right through june and july on saur mogila torez and snizhne it is most likely that kiev
did have aircraft conducting raids
just some of the many ukraine aircraft attacks in 2014 showing ukraine air force very active over these months and these are only some of those caught on camera
LUGANSK CITY HALL JUNE 2ND
SLAVYANSK JUNE 3RD
DONETSK MAY 23RD
A LOOK AT BELLINGCAT NORTHERN SUSPECTED BUK LAUNCH SITE {and the one he wants to forget}
This site could be a more likely site as any buk launched from here would strike the left hand side of the plane where the most damage appears to have taken place. And as you can see from the overview of the area around the northern buk site in the photos below and from eyewitnesses videos that although less populated than the southern sites it has a number of towns and villages on the supposed route of the buk missile.There is also a number of open mines in the area and one of these mines appears to be the location from which one of the videos were shot from.So to think that nobody and not even the camera holder seen a buk missile contrail or heard it being fired is difficult to imagine as people in grabova were on the crash scene within moments of impact.
The buk site everyone wants to forget
One site that bellingcat seems to have distanced himself from {i don't blame him} is the site referred to in the so called intercepted phone call in which kiev claims is the rebels discussing the mh17 crash. This phonecall is what appears to be the main "evidence"that the united states and western media has based their proof the rebels did this.
At the start of the conversation they say the plane came down just outside the the town of enakievo however this is 30 kilometers from the debris of mh17 this could be put down to a simple misjudgment as 30 km in the sky may look closer as there is no reference points.But then they state that a plume of smoke is visible outside enakievo this another oddity as main fireball and smoke is in grabova 30km away also time stamp on video is also suspicious.Which also appears to be a mash up of different phone calls.
Then according to the men on the tape say will set of to find crash site at 4.40 pm i will include alleged buk launch site as location they set off from as this would be closer to petropavlovskaya mines.Tape starts again at 5.11 pm and the men state now apparently they found the crash site at petropavlovskaya mines which is 35km from suspected buk site of chernukhino just east of debaltseve how did hell did they travel 35km in 30 minutes and find 200 bodies in an area that is actually 30 km northeast of the actual crash site at grabova.
i google searched petropavloskaya mines and the closet one on the world map is 35km northeast of the crash site unless there is a mine with that name around grabova it is impossible that they found 200 bodies at petropavlovskaya mines so this shows that the kiev government are extremely untrustworthy if they are willing to fabricate "evidence" to garner international military support you can see this phone call here which kiev deleted from their youtube accounts once they realized their mistake but by then it had already been downloaded by over 100 people.
why did nobody come to secure the crash site +victims
After the crash rebel fighters offered to cease military activity and shelling for up 30 km around the site kiev refused this offer and in the following days launched a major artillery assault on the site at grabova as there was little tactical advantage for either side why was this done??.rebel fighters were in control of the site and asked the osce to come and secure the site as they were stretched on manpower the osce refused but told rebel leaders not to remove any debris or the bodies rebels agreed to this demand and stated that due to the summer heat this should be done within 24 hours.
On day 2 rebels again asked the osce when would they arrive as the bodies were starting to swell in the summer heat to which they got no reply. It wasn't until 70 international reporters arrived at the crash site and began filming the severe bloating on the bodies that the osce finally gave the rebels written permission to begin removing the bodies to the derision of western press. Osce personnel finally arrived at the site and locals were eager to tell them that mh17 was brought down by a fighterplane but amazingly osce said to them that "we still think a buk brought it down". Malaysia sent 30 people to kiev to help with the investigation but kiev said that it was to dangerous to bring them to the crash site however rebels said they would be safe from any attack on them and would even be willing to provide armed protection for them. Kiev still would not allow it stated it was to risky for the malaysians. The maylasian investigators spent a month in kiev before travelling home without seeing the crash site.
One malaysian decided to go to the crash on his own via taxi and as promised by rebels he was escorted to the site. Upon seeing the wreckage and speaking to locals he came to the conclusion that the fighterplane was the most likely culprit for this conclusion maylasian was excluded from the official investigation which surprising is led by kiev who has a veto to exclude any evidence they see fit. On the 7th august the dutch government and america,australia,ukraine and belgium signed a non disclosure agreement on the fings on mh17 which makes it a secret investigation which with kiev having the final say on what is released makes it likely the finished report will never be published.
rebel fighters also stated that on a number of nights they apprehended people who claiming to be locals who were not judging by their accents trying to remove debris this could be down to morbid trophy hunters or kiev SBU agents but this was not made clear by rebels
a number of documentaries were made and you can watch them here and pages of interest
Mh17 the untold story {rt}
Flight mh17 the untold story {storm clouds gathering}
Mh17 fully exposed {corbett report}
Bbc eyewitness account {now deleted from their site}
Or see the badly photo-shopped buk
blogger max van der werf << recommended
person of interest 1 saur mogila smoke
person of interets 2 saur mogila smoke
person of interest 3 possible contrail photog
naf-fund
